#StorageSummit - CrowdChat

Storage Backup

Wikibon and storage experts discuss how to meet backup SLAs and reduce costs.

#storagesummit @oraclehardware @furrier @dvellante oracle backup storage

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#storagesummitStorage for Oracle DBStorage experts discuss how to get superior performance from your Oracle database.

#StorageSummitKeeping Data ForeverWikibon & Oracle discuss the issues around keeping data forever, incl. tape v. cloud archive debate

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Dave Vellante30

@dfloyer did some killer research on flash-first - here were my big takeaways http://goo.gl/rjNwq6

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what do IT managers need to know about flash first and oracle?

Dave Vellante 1/ "Hi speed disk" is an oxymoron - it's dead; 2/ flash will replace all hi spin speed disk; 3/ flash-first will scale better and prove cheaper than flash cache solutions

Dave Vellante the other key takeaway john is this: if you optimize storage w/flash you can cut cpu cores - which will cut orcle DB lic & maint costs (Larry I'm sure doesn't advertise this fact!)

Robert Klusman Yes.. Few of them truly understand how critical low latency these IOPs are to the DB..

John Furrier hybrid flash systems may be best option where processing performance matters .. do you agree?

Robert Klusman Carving out "parts" of a DB for Flash disk is risky & messy.. So the Hybrid approach of ZS3 makes perfect sense

Kerstin Woods @Wikibon has a great summary of the benefits of flash-first with Oracle #ZS3 achieving Tier 1 Performance at Tier 3 Prices: http://wikibon.org/wiki/v/Oracle_ZS3_Storage_Appliances%3A_Tier-1_Performance_at_Tier-3_Prices

Kerstin Woods Not all hybrids are created equal according to this #DCIG buying guide: https://go.oracle.com/LP=1427?elqCampaignId=3753

Oracle Hardware

Has the high cost of a flash-first architecture come down to the point its viable for most organizations?

Oracle Hardware23

Are you making your backup windows? Reports out there suggest that a high percentage of backups fail. What’s your experience?

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Oracle Hardware

http://medianetwork.oracle.com/video/player/3050031627001

Oracle ZS3 Series Storage: Oracle Engineered Systems Backup
The Oracle ZFS Storage Appliance provides an integrated high-performance backup solution for Oracle engineered systems.

I was with a customer yesterday who took 4 days to restore / recover a 2.4TB DB. That was super pain full for them

Oracle Hardware Were they backing up from disk or tape? Why did the backup take so long?

Being down for four days can certainly have an impact on your business

Oracle Hardware What are the reasons for a long recovery period?

Growing data & shrinking backup windows require new solutions. Apollo Group was successful slashing backups from 24 hours to 1 hour: http://link.brightcove.com/services/player/bcpid62612523001?bctid=2031772882001&playerType=

Apollo Group Streamlines with Integrated Oracle Solution
Apollo Group selected an integrated hardware and software solution from Oracle including Oracle Exadata running E-Business Suite and the Sun ZFS Storage Appliance for backup and recovery.

The challenge turned out to be how LONG it takes them to backup.. They take so long to put the backups to disk -- then tape. Takes more than a 6hrs to backup.. So fulls are only done on weekends..

Michael Brown No Mun Myung, IT Dept Mgr at KED said: “We achieved 10x database compression by applying Oracle Hybrid Columnar Compression technology on Oracle’s Sun ZFS Storage appliances, drastically reducing backup storage size to obtain a high degree of stability.”

Korea Enterprise Data reduced backup times from 2 hours to 17 minutes with Oracle ZFS Storage. See http://www.oracle.com/us/corporate/customers/customersearch/korea-enterprise-5-sparc-cs-2028708.html

Customer and Partner Search Korea Enterprise Data Consolidates 20 Servers to One Platform, Improves System Response Time by 20x, and Lowers Total Cost...
Korea Enterprise Data consolidated 20 servers using Oracle SuperCluster engineered systems and improved OLTP response time for managing large volumes of sensitive credit data, and for responding to customer. The company also deployed Oracle’s Sun ZFS...

Dave Vellante12

Hanging w/ Oracle IT pros in San Jose http://goo.gl/qpolzX

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Hey - I know that guy! (he might work for me ;-)

what are customers asking about at the event?

Dave Vellante spoke to ~30 people - 1/flash - not much use but growing; 2/ tape - only 1 practitioner doesn't use any tape; 3/ Archiving - why it's so expensive; 4/ cloud - pressure to replicate AWS-like experiences

Dave Vellante we also talked about the best use cases for ZFS - which we feel is as a backup target - orcle/ZFS not there yet for oltp apps

Michael Brown Archiving doesn't have to be expensive to be fast. Automated tiered storage solutions with Flash or Disk as the tier-1 and tape behind it gives you the best of both. http://www.oracle.com/us/solutions/oos/tiered-storage-infrastructure/overview/index.html

Oracle Optimized Solution for Tiered Storage Infrastructure
Oracle Optimized Solution for Tiered Storage Infrastructure

Interesting on the tape results. It's definitely part of Oracle's backup/archiving solutions.

See Wikibon write up on tape http://bit.ly/1clvzxS

Oracle Hardware9

Lots of controversy on data deduplication vs. data compression. Which is more effective?

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Oracle Hardware

Funny video on storage compression https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gndqo2epDnQ&feature=youtu.be

Smarter storage with Oracle Advanced compression & Hyrbrid Columnar Compression (HCC)
Oracle partner services helps you get the most out Advanced compression option for Oracle Database on any storage system. Oracles storage system ZFS includes...

I think the Value to Dedup varies heavily on the data source.. Ex: MS office files have high Dedup value.. Oracle Backups have High compression Value (they don' dedup well)

Here's a scan of recent tape headlines from the trade rags http://goo.gl/0itwNO

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Tape is alive and well, especially in deep archive cloud environments -- used by the leading internet and social media companies

Oracle Hardware

Apparently Google doesn't think tape is dead: https://www.google.com/about/datacenters/gallery/#/tech/17

Google – See where the Internet lives
Take a look inside Google’s data centers around the world. See photos of the technology, people and places that keep our products online.

Robert Klusman These are impressive Photos.. That is a HUGE environment

Oracle Hardware photo caption: "In case anything should happen to our data, we have it all backed up. One of the places we back up information is here in our tape library. Robotic arms (visible at the end of the aisle) assist us in loading and unloading"

Just 2 weeks back, I was helping a customer backup a large Oracle DB.. We used SL3000 + 310kC drives... We got over 750M a second to tape.. Customer was floored.. (happy)

Robert Klusman That was 3 10kc drives..

Really like the @Wikibon view of this fact that tape isn't dead: http://wikibon.org/wiki/v/Rise_of_the_Machines%3A_The_Rebirth_of_Tape

Even the Economist is all in on tape http://econ.st/1g72rdS

Magnetic tape to the rescue
WHEN physicists switch on the Large Hadron Collider (LHC), between three and six gigabytes of data spew out of it every second. That is, admittedly, an extreme...

Oracle Hardware9

Have you had to restore data from a backup? Was it successful? Did it meet your RTO? Again, reports suggest that a high percentage of restores fail. What’s your backup strategy? D2D, D2D2T? D2T? D2Cloud? D2T2Cloud?

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Oracle Hardware

Here's how RL Polk backs up its database: http://medianetwork.oracle.com/video/player/2065746194001

RL Polk Leverages Oracle HCC with Oracle’s Sun ZFS Storage
RL Polk uses Oracle Hybrid Columnar Compression in its Exadata and Sun ZFS Storage Appliance. HCC is critical to Polk’s ability to replicate its database in the ZFS Storage appliance to the development and test environment.

Dave Vellante the majority of ZFS users we talked to were using the system as a backup target

Kerstin Woods This is a great example of getting a lot from your data - backups and test/development with Hybrid Columnar Compression for significant cost savings.

I was with a DBA & Storage team of a Large Bank monday.. The Storage guy said "Restores don't matter - We care about backups".. DBA almost fell out of his chair.. and said "RTO is all that matters"

Robert Klusman Clearly a disconnect on how important recovery is to the DBA team.

Dave Vellante Backup is one thing...recover is EVERYTHING!

Some of the research I shared w/the oracle IT pros was the benefit of flash-first architectures vs. cache-first - at scale - flash first is WAY less expensive http://wikibon.org/w/images/0/06/UpdatedZFSFigure6a.png

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Oracle Hardware

Studies show that tiered storage backup environments (D2D2T) have lower TCO than all-disk. What’s your experience?

Oracle Hardware http://www.oracle.com/us/corporate/analystreports/industries/clipper-tco-storage-2013-1959019.pdf

Dave Vellante wikibon practitioners are shifting backup to disk and re-positioning tape for archive & deep archive

This is so critical for our Large DB customers.. The technology standards most of our customers have today - literally can't protect the large DBs they have..

Complete Wikibon write up available here http://bit.ly/1icydbB

John Furrier the Total Cost of Ownership angle is very relevant when planning and deploying storage imo

Oracle Hardware7

What’s the best solution for backup? Single-purpose appliances (DataDomain) vs. general purpose disk?

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They each have their place.. DD does a really good dedup job in large VDI / VmFarms.. But for protection of Oracle DBs - DD is simply a risky choice..

Oracle Hardware @oraclehardware Here is a list of shortcomings of Data Domain v. Oracle ZS3

DD single controller plus slow backup/recovery speed makes it risky for Oracle DBs

Purpose built backup appliances are exactly that - purpose built for backup. That's expensive when you only run backup 10% or 20% of the time. With Oracle ZFS Storage you can do backups AND use the same systems for test/dev - with no added costs.

Oracle Hardware4

To kick things off, as a (Oracle Database?) backup manager, what keeps you awake at night?

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I often hear people say how do I determine what is critical data and where do I put it

Dave Vellante the answer is take an application view - that will help determine data value

making sure my data is really backed up...not sure I trust my backup guy!

Oracle Hardware That's a common nightmare. How do you ensure your data is REALLY backed up?

Oracle Hardware3

We're on the home stretch of today's CrowdChat. Thanks everyone for joining. And remember to backup your data!

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great chat

Agreed..