ThirdWave

Next Wave Data Management
Learn how to gain visibility, insight & control over data by automating workflows in a closed loop.
   10 years ago
#ThirdWaveNext Wave Data ManagementLearn how to gain visibility, insight & control over data on premise as well as in the hybrid cloud
Storage Alchemist
Q7. Serious now... Could a good copy data solution or #catalog replace a traditional "backup" solution?
John Furrier
some may say no way bc backup is a ingrained mindset
CrowdFather
backup will swim with the fishes
Peter Eicher
Yes, but only if you're keeping copies on separate hardware, not just on the primary. And also off-site.
Dave Vellante
yes no question - you could use the catalog as a general purpose copy management solution or apply it to backup use cases - assuming good snapshot tech is in place
Dave Vellante
I think backup is the obvious first use case step for catalog
Jay Livens
IMO, what you need is a universal catalogue that blends all tech. Snaps, BU, CDP, Replication, etc... You can then match the service level to the app.
storageswiss
Does it replace backup or just become the backup. The function of protecting data still exists, but it is integrated into the #SnapCracklePop Software or #Snapalog
ttessks
@ We adopt better technology quickly once we know enough so I would say yes
Storage Alchemist
@furrier right on John, do we ever think this will change?
storageswiss
@JLivens Totally agree, but the #SnapCracklePop software has to then start communicating with the admin in SLO terms. I want X RTO for this app and Y RTO for that app. Go do it Mr. #SnapCracklePop Software
Ira Goodman
With the RIGHT #catalog, an open minded IT guy should be able to see the value in it and stop thinking about the traditional backup solutions that they know and love so dearly.
Peter Eicher
Snapalog is basically bringing disk up to 1990s backup technology. Why the disk vendors never built their own catalogs is a mystery no one can solve.
John Furrier
change will happen with better tech, functionality, and economics
Jay Livens
@Peter_Eicher Yes, but a Snapalog is creating another catalogue island. You want an uber catalogue that subsumes the snapalog.
storageswiss
@JLivens Why can't the #snapalog become the uber catalog?
Peter Eicher
@storageswiss One catalog to rule them all.
Jay Livens
@storageswiss It could. I don't really care what you call it. However, snapalog makes it sound like it only does snaps which defeats the purpose, IMO.
storageswiss
@Peter_Eicher right. if the #snapalog is off primary storage system no reason why it can't support everything.
Storage Alchemist
Q6. With the right tools are, is it a #datacatalog? and what do you think the real cost savings or ROI could be?
Sathya Sankaran
@skenniston, Absolutely! Not using one is penny wise pound foolish! #Catalog is key
Dave Vellante
Here's some data from @dfloyer using a 20 filer example http://wikibon.org/w...

Jay Livens
I think that this is getting close to a traditional archive. That is moving old/redundant data onto less expensive storage.
Dave Vellante
NetApp snapshot tech is among the best in the business but most/many customers are not taking full advantage
Storage Alchemist
@dvellante they have been talking about leveraging snaps for decades... why haven't people done this?
storageswiss
@dvellante I think we need a better term than Snapshot Catalog... Does not really describe what is going on.
Peter Eicher
Agree that catalog/index is critical. Especially as you start to move snaps/copies across tiers, across sites, etc.
Storage Alchemist
@storageswiss what does describe it best? -
Dave Vellante
@JLivens Flape! (Flash + tape) :-)
Peter Eicher
"Catalog" is basically borrowed from the backup world. What people are used to. It's intuitive. But that doesn't mean it's necessarily the best choice.
storageswiss
You have to get the snapshot off the primary storage system. Too much can go wrong with your snapshot and your data on primary storage
Storage Alchemist
@JLivens can you do this, while at the same time reducing the overall creation of copies?
Peter Eicher
@storageswiss Snapshot + Catalog = Snapalog
storageswiss
@Peter_Eicher Stealing a term from an industry that most think is dead and I have to convince them that it is not is probably not the best marketing strategy.
Jay Livens
Duplicates will always exist because people will create them. The question is how long until you can remove them.
Storage Alchemist
@Peter_Eicher LOVE IT - I am stealing it... NICE ONE
Jay Livens
IMO, duplicates if managed effectively aren't actually an issue.
ttessks
@Peter_Eicher Control center, deck of Enterprise...I think we have had this conversation!
Peter Eicher
@ttessks Once or twice. Or ten times.
ttessks
@JLivens But does anyone manage them? How many TB of wasted space are holding duplicates that are over a year old? I think most admins just don't know.
storageswiss
Let's get with Kellog's... SnapCracklePop. Manage your snapshots, crack your backup windows in half and Pop your applications back into production.
Jay Livens
I agree and it becomes a matter of priorities and pain. People often focus elsewhere where the perceived pain is higher.