StateofWork

No, they need to have a mind to solve problems

Perhaps we should also ask what skills should be THE SAME for aspirational developers and traditional i.e planning discipline, communications openness etc.

I think the focus is too much on code, what about business need, requirements, ownership of outcomes

Logic processing

@jason_wojahn Right, solving a business problem instead of a engineering problem

Logic processing sounds like algebra to aspirational developers --- we need to keep this more open

@sparks_jonathan being close to the business need and taking ownership of the outcome... sounds pretty agile....

Although I do take your point Sanjay :-)

Theoretically the aspirational developer should not have to have traditional coding skills. Bring Your Own Domain Knowledge should be enough.

Not in the engineering sense. More in terms of what they need to get done.

if you take away syntax from programming your left with logic. Logic is more important than syntax.

Let's remember, 8 years ago we didn't have the iPad and non-techies didn't know what an "app" was

Think they should ate least be capable of doing Excel macro level algorithms.

Now non-techies are (slowly) hearing about these things called APIs

@jhammond that's what AUTO-SUM is for (just kidding)

With simple drag and drop platforms and products like Service Creator, the code is nearly invisible http://www.serviceno...

Look at what kids are able to do in Scratch and Minecraft - but there's still some typing required :-)

Absolutely Jeffrey YES! .... actually go one step further back, what about Doom and the option to create your own world-spaces?

@kristinemi Awesome :-)

@jhammond Kids call it "keyboarding" now :)

It's really cool to see 10 year olds doing embedded programming these days - look at something like First Lego League...

I must remember that for my next expense report!

@jhammond You point is very valid, barrier to entry is dropping

@jhammond Learning to develop is hidden for new generations- I learned HTML because of Myspace and now kids are modding with Minecraft

@kristinemi Yea, it's kind of scary. My 6 year old kid can do more complex stuff in Minecraft than I can do...

when things like powerpoint make presentations easy so we are seeing coding UX apps for anyone to create.

Just look at Web development, the bar has been lowered so much that you don't have to really code.

@furrier Citizen Developers

It's a future state imo at least now but the path is clear - tooling is coming

BTW @jason_wojahn , congrats on Cloud Sherpas being acquired by Accenture. #WellDone

@furrier is there a cut off point where we stop giving aspirational developers TOO much tooling?

yes tool overload will come but the platforms have to evolve as tools become more proliferated

We already know this is the case. There have been examples of this in the past - i.e. Notes and Quickbase. And this is something we see people doing with our Platform here at ServiceNow.

@cahaikes I second that. Look at CMS platforms setting up a blog doesn't require advanced knowledge.

tools for tools sake is not the answer imo; platforms & data have to be robust and extensible

in a low-code model good development practice and standards are paramount.

I Agree @cahaikes, low-code is happening today- building a website using drag and drop in Wix or Squarespace

Matt makes a great point; CMS need to handle push notifications not just polling databases; api integration is huge

Plus school kids are getting exposed to the concept of coding at a younger age that they will have fewer psychological barriers to the concept.

@cahaikes > When does coding become a core requirement in HS, like Bio, Chem, & Physics

@cahaikes gr8 point about kids; structured programming edu is gr8 building blocks on thinking about future

@furrier > We've interviews some fantastic teachers on #theCUBE, changing the CS education game.

@furrier > And the president of Harvey Mudd says it's actually better to start them as freshman in College

I would say there truly are today, but I think it needs to get a bit more easier before it will explode

@cahaikes > Very important point, can be aspirational if you think the are barriers too high

> Toooo many / too much tooling can become a problem in it it's own right.

Every year we ask devs why they write code, including aspirational ones

Some reasons: 42% say to improve their productivity at work

Technology is moving further up the stack, which has removed the need for an engineering background to build applications. As technology get’s simpler, these folks are thinking to themselves, I can do this myself.

The same behavior that have driven Sharepoint sites and departmental spreadsheets #businessneeds

@jhammond Is the term "aspirational" setting the right tone? Is it positive enough? Is it condescending at all?

58% generally enjoy programming and learning about new tech.

#Opensource has facilitated the ability to "assemble" applications

64% as part of a person hobby or pastime

devs - pro or not - get their serotonin jolts from writing code, like a musician needs to play music!

> Desperation to get things done?

@jhammond Those who are considered aspirational find this out as soon as they get their hands on a Platform where they can build stuff on their own - i.e. ServiceNow

@sparks_jonathan Bring your own device has become bring your own development ... so why not eh?

I like "Aspirational" better than "Citizen" developer

> I think a more interesting question, is how to do inform them that they CAN create applications

Access to simple tools that have a gr8 UX is huge + access to data

Also like it better than "non-professional" as many of the devs are "professionals" even if that don't get paid to write code per-se...

@furrier Great point on the UX John.

abstracting away complexity for fast app building #TimetoValue

@JeffFrick Taking matters into their own hands - yeah.

@furrier as long as abstraction is never a case of dumbing down functionality

> Before they're aspirational, they need to know it's in the real of possibility.

@JeffFrick Seems like the more rules IT creates - the more it drives shadow IT, where aspirational devs tend to lurk.

The days for needing to code/program to create apps are over.

I think you'll always have to type a bit (at least until NLP takes over.

Sanjay - even w/ MIT Scratch, Minecraft or Unity - there's still "programming" - it just takes a different shape.

That's one reason we tend to call new tools in this space "low code" as opposed to "no code"

@abridgwater Yes maybe a little coding but that need is coming down rapidly...

I have a dev segmentation model I use w/ clients, and I have a segment called the "aspirant" - it's pretty close.

@jason_wojahn > Certainly what Atlassian is selling as a vision, JIRA, Confluence, HipChat - reduce email.

> Always interesting to see how density of information changes with experience. Start small, then load up once things are more failiary