haflash

High Availability Flash
Join Fusion.io for CrowdChat thought leader conversation on high availability flash storage
garyorenstein
One more item on high availability with flash - folks ask should I replicate in the server? I usually recommend across servers and physical locations for the utmost availability.
Dave Vellante
single pt of failure transcends the building at that point...
Fusion-io
Another good case study is a our customer Polaris, who took query times from 3 minutes (with frequent time outs) to an average of 2-3 seconds. This included full HA with SIOS DataKeeper. http://www.fusionio.com/blog/polaris-sios/
John Furrier
how old is that case study?
Fusion-io Just over a year. We still do a lot of work with @SIOSTech.
Dave Vellante
What has to be done to eliminate legacy IO protocols and what will be the impact on HA?
garyorenstein
anytime you can remove bottlenecks you can speed up the system. faster transactions and faster logging with flash, coupled with flash-to-flash replication for HA brings performance up and costs down.
David Floyer
The legacy IO protocols were design for magnetic spinning disk, and designed to ensure integrity of disk writes. Within the protocol are n-phase commits, which require multiple exchanges. Moving to flash as an extension of DRAM would simplify...
David Floyer
... atomic writes are part of the T10 submissions and can achieve this. In HA, the data could be written to flash directly on one system in parallel with data being sent to another server and being written to flash on the second system
Dave Vellante
is there an analog to write integrity with flash "garbage collection" david?
Soham Chakraborty
and another one. What in-house/default tool you suggest for benchmarking the iops. blktrace of Jens Axobe is what I have used extensively on disk based environment. Is it same for flash or anything else?
Dave Vellante
I'm no expert but I know a lot of practitioners that use iometer cause it's simple
garyorenstein
in general we recommended benchmarking at the application transaction level. sometimes people talk about using iometer and I joke "do you run your business on iometer?" :)
Soham Chakraborty Okay, now the tough part is whenever users face a bottleneck they think it is either storage or OS. Coming from Linux background, it is quite troublesome to let them explain about app level. Then question, what metric on app level :)
garyorenstein agree with challenges Soham. We see it as a transformation where huge benefits come from rethinking prior assumptions
John Furrier
Soham great questions - i voted for this
Soham Chakraborty Thanks John. I am always curious about performance engineering ;)
garyorenstein
one of the creative stats I saw last week from eBay was URLs per Kilowatt. they really narrowed down what mattered up top (pages served) with costs on the bottom (electricity)
John Furrier
I have to ask a simple basic question...why do I care about HA if I'm a CIO
Dave Vellante
app goes down...co loses money...cio gets fired
Crowd Captain I mean in context to flash architectures
garyorenstein
how about that time is money maxim :)
garyorenstein
HA choices can be a strategic weapon for CIOs. In the past, storage HA was the ONLY choice. Now you can choose that OR server layer. Means more negotiating power.
Aaron Nuechterlein
What is Fusion-IO’s thoughts on Sata Express? How will your company embrace this technology to promote widespread adoption of PCI Express SSDs? #Flash #Storage
garyorenstein
SATA is great for disk drives and we use it extensively in our hybrid storage appliance. but for letting flash do what it does best, a PCIe based approach is best
Dave Vellante see "the best io is no io"
Aaron Nuechterlein Seeing as SATA Express utilizes a PCIe based interface do you have plans to implement it? And interesting find on the Macbook...
garyorenstein
interesting to note that apple promotes "PCIe-based flash" when you go to buy a Macbook. They are good indicators of where the industry is heading http://store.apple.com/us/buy-mac/macbook-pro
Fusion-io
With flash you can do server replication with your preferred vendor. HP shared this example of high performance and high availability - http://h20195.www2.hp.com/v2/GetPDF.aspx%2F4AA4-8036ENW.pdf
Soham Chakraborty
Considering a medium sized organization, how would you suggest going for a flash based HA architecture? HA being included in app and not being app are two conditions. #flash #haflash
garyorenstein
in the app, you could take advantage of SQL Server Always On / Mirroring / Replication or Oracle ASM / Dataguard...
garyorenstein
an with in the app you can use in server flash
garyorenstein
without HA at the application layer you could use a hybrid storage appliance which has active-active controllers like our ioControl product or
garyorenstein
or another option for peak performance without HA at the application layer is an all flash appliance replicating to a second all flash appliance
Dave Vellante
Here's a good resource fm oracle on H/A architectures http://docs.oracle.com/cd/B28359_01/server.111/b28281/architectures.htm#g1012375
John Furrier what is your angle on applications
John Furrier
what apps are you thinking about?
Soham Chakraborty mostly oracle and derivatives. However, I have little choice over apps which customers use.
David Floyer
Putting HA in the application layer gives the greatest flexibility and the lowest infrastructure cost. HA has to include data availability, integrity & recovery. Using flash as part of the storage can significantly help recovery times
garyorenstein agree. HA at app and in server flash are max performance min footprint. but storage failover can be FAST
David Floyer
If the HA is not included App, then using flash well in the storage layer can provide storage redundancy (replication) and provide fast recovery. This has to be done for legacy applications with no HA awareness.
John Furrier
How do you best architect flash where HA is not built in to the application #flash #storage #cloud
garyorenstein
a few options to do at the storage layer. 1) replicate between flash appliance nodes synchronously, a benefit of fast flash-flash replication ...
garyorenstein
2) another option is active-active controller architectures in the storage appliance itself...similar to our ioControl Hybrid Storage product http://www.fusionio.com/products/iocontrol
Dave Vellante
What does it mean that pcie doesn't have dual porting? Does that mean generally apps will handle h/a? or is there a HW option too?
garyorenstein
two separate things. You can have dual porting PCIe. Servers over time will be architected as such.
Dave Vellante is this a standards issue - i.e. is that in the stds committees?
garyorenstein
In the meantime you can get HA in a single box with dual controllers, or go to a server-server HA setup
garyorenstein
more of an issue that server architectures do not change overnight. interfaces/specifications moving along well.
David Floyer
The normal way of handling it is to use RAID 1 or mirror the data on a different server - obviously this can impact RT